SUMMARY KEYWORDS
podcast, book, people, alastair, interview, listener, marketing, mcdermott, author, podcasters, episode, listening, write, talk, work, guests, mentioned, business, audio, call
SPEAKERS
Voiceover, Douglas Burdett, Alastair McDermott
Voiceover 00:00
Welcome to The Recognized Authority, a podcast that helps specialized consultants and domain experts on your journey to become known as an authority in your field. Here’s your host, Alastair McDermott.
Alastair McDermott 00:11
I was recently interviewed by Douglas Burnett on one of my favorite podcasts, which is the marketing book podcast. And I’ve been a longtime listener to that show, because it’s hugely informative. It helps me figure out what books I should be checking out. And it’s also really entertaining I love Douglass’s style. So what follows this introduction is the entire episode from my appearance on his show. And if you find it useful, or interesting, I encourage you to go check out the marketing book podcast. Now over to Douglas. This is Alastair McDermott, author of 33 ways not to screw up your business podcast, a comprehensive guide to planning recording and launching your business podcast. And you are listening to the 400 and 50th episode of the marketing book podcast.
Voiceover 00:59
Welcome to the marketing book podcast, helping you keep up with the smartest thinking and the quickly changing field of modern marketing. And now here’s your host, that was verdad
Douglas Burdett 01:10
Hello, thanks for joining me on the marketing book Podcast where each week I published an interview with the author of a new marketing or sales book and which has been named by Forbes and LinkedIn amongst others is one of the top marketing podcasts. Don’t worry about taking notes. You can find links to everything linkable in this episode’s website page, marketing book podcast.com. And since I get to read every book featured on the show, if I can recommend a specific marketing or sales book or any other resource I know for whatever challenge you’re facing, send me a LinkedIn connection invite with a message that you’re a listener, and I will do my best to get you pointed in the right direction. My name again is Douglas Burnett. All right, let’s get on with the show. Today we welcome Alastair McDermott to talk about his book 33 ways not to screw up your business podcast a comprehensive guide to planning recording and launching your business podcast published by networking publishing. Alastair McDermott helps best kept secret experts and consultants to rapidly build authority by leveraging the power of podcasting so that they can command premium fees cherry pick the best projects get off the gilded hamster wheel of hourly rate work and never have to suffer a bad fit client again, sweet Aleister is an author, consultant and business coach who hosts The Recognized Authority podcast, the specialization podcast and the Accelerating Your Authority podcast. He’s the author of two other books, including how to sound and look good on Zoom, and podcast tips and audio video recommendations for consultants and experts. And I’m going to provide a link for listeners to get the book on Amazon for free and for the love of all things. Holy. Please, everybody. download that and read it. And interesting fact. Aleister lives on the beautiful west coast of Ireland.
Douglas Burdett 03:08
Alistair, congratulations on 33 ways not to screw up your business podcast and welcome to the 450th episode of the marketing book podcast.
Alastair McDermott 03:17
Douglas, thank you so much for having me on. I’m really thrilled to be here because I’m alone longtime listener, and so it’s an honor to be on the show.
Douglas Burdett 03:25
Well, and I think folks know what that means about Alastair McDermott. He’s a ridiculously good looking guy. This is true. Yes, it is. It is. And for those that need a picture, go to marketing book podcast.com. See this episode. So you are the second author I’ve interviewed who is in Ireland. The first was Aiden, McAllen, author of undisrupted evil, I interviewed him in July of 2022, during a heatwave, he was he was a very good sport. And you two have some connection, some rugby connection, is that right?
Alastair McDermott 03:59
That’s right. Yeah, I played rugby for about 2025 years, but never ever at a high level like he did. But I followed the team that he played for. So the professional team so that’s Leinster. So, yeah. So that was that was that was great to hear, you know, the writers voice on the podcast.
Douglas Burdett 04:15
Yes. And he’s working on a few other books, they’ll probably never come back just because, you know, I was such a knucklehead. But, you know, Hope springs eternal. And, you know, I can dream can i? Now, I should mention that you’re being an author. This is genetic, because both your parents are authors, right?
Alastair McDermott 04:30
Yeah, that’s right. So both, I guess we just have one of those families where it’s kind of in the genes, but both my parents are historians and history based books. And yeah, so very wide ranging in scope. Actually, they’ve both written multiple books. My dad’s written a fiction novel as well. Mom has written books about learning about philosophy, and all sorts of stuff so and also about history. So wow, yeah, we We’ve kind of have that in the in the in the blood.
Douglas Burdett 05:02
Yeah. Sounds like you better write a few more books because they may still be wondering if you know if you’re gonna make anything of yourself.
Alastair McDermott 05:07
Well, I did say that this is my first appearance on this episode on this podcast, I think to be back.
Douglas Burdett 05:14
Oh, well, good, good. Well, there is no way a better way to celebrate a milestone than with an Irishman. And I don’t know what it is about Irish people that makes me want to celebrate. They’re always after me Lucky Charms. And all this week. As we mentioned before I’ve been before we started recording, I’ve been watching Irish history documentaries on YouTube. And as I’ve been preparing for this interview, all week, I’ve been doing two things while I read your book, which only took about an hour. And I’ve been drinking Irish whiskey, including this morning. And I’ve been listening to some beautiful, traditional Irish music like this
Douglas Burdett 06:09
Okay, so now that I’ve offended pretty much every Irish listener,
Alastair McDermott 06:13
it’s great. I’m dancing here. It’s a pity we’re not doing a video because because I’m just dancing here. Yes, yes.
Douglas Burdett 06:17
And we’re going to talk we’re going to talk about video. So this book is part of a series of 33 ways books, there must be a dozen or so you know, 33 ways not to screw up and then fill in the blank. So this is not the first 33 ways book on the marketing book podcast, a little bit of marketing book podcast trivia, Episode 363. I interviewed and Jan Xur, a member of the marketing book podcast for timers club about the book she wrote 33 ways not to screw up your business emails. And it was for a special Christmas episode at the end of 2021. And as I read through those 33 chapters in her book, I noticed a lot of things. I was doing wrong near nearly every chapter. And Alastair McDermott, I had a similar sensation while reading your book about how not to screw up a business podcast because there’s just a lot of things I’m not doing right and things I should be doing. And anyway, and she mentioned me in her book in one of her chapters, and like in her book, in your book, you mentioned me and I Aleister I mean this sincerely, I was really touched that you dedicated the book to me, and I’m going to read it right now. It says for Douglas fir DEP host of the marketing book podcast. No podcaster needs this book more than you do. With Love from one of your loyal listeners. Alastair McDermott. Thank you. Thank you.
Alastair McDermott 07:40
It was my my true pleasure to write that. I think I got chat TPT to help with that.
Douglas Burdett 07:46
Okay, good. Yeah, that’s great. Now, I’m kidding. Of course, he didn’t dedicate the book to me. But Alastair, did you really have to feature the marketing book podcast in nearly every chapter is an example of what not to do. I mean, come on, maybe a few examples, but not in every all 33 chapters.
Alastair McDermott 08:06
It’s nice to tie the book together. You know, the thread? Yes,
Douglas Burdett 08:09
the thread that goes through all of it. So no, seriously, folks. He was very generous. He didn’t mention me. But I knew what he was talking about that because I do a lot of things wrong. And I just quick tangent. Have you ever seen in like an office or there’s like these motivational posters in the break room. I don’t know if they have them in the in Ireland or the UK or whatever. But in the United States, sometimes you’ll see, like, you know, a picture and it has a beautiful picture of rowers, and it’ll say like teamwork, a big headline, there’s a sentence below it. Okay, so we
Alastair McDermott 08:44
got those. Okay. I’m sorry to hear that in my office. I’ve got Cartman in my office, Cartman. Oh, really? Your South Park fan? Oh, yeah. So he’s my he’s my hero.
Douglas Burdett 08:52
Okay. So there’s a website called despair.com, which I love and it what it is, they produce all these posters that are a parody of those kinds of posters. And what they’ll have is like a beautiful picture, and then a word and you can actually put them up in an office space. And I don’t think people would notice that it’s actually being very, you know, ironic, satirical, sarcastic. And so there’s this one poster that brought to mind me as it relates to your book. And it’s a beautiful picture of a ship that’s sinking. And it’s got like blue water and orange sky and the big word says mistakes. And then below that, it says it could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others. And I know I realized that I know that and you know what, I don’t care. I don’t care. What got me. Now, if you’re like Steve Sheinkopf, who’s the CEO of Yale appliance in Boston, Massachusetts, he’s already said he’s not going to listen to this episode. He knows that it’s going to be recorded. He said, he’s he’s not gonna listen to it. And if you’re not a podcaster, and you’re not thinking about starting a podcast, I want you to know, and you’re still listening, I want you to know that most of the things we’re going to talk about can be applied to nearly any kind of content creation to build your authority. And I may ask a specific question or two, but I would hope that this interview would have valuable lessons for the marketers and the salespeople and all the others who are listening. Also, I’m suffering, I’m sure from the curse of knowledge. And I’m too close to the topic. And I say that because in the year 2020, just before the lockdown started, I was invited by the Local Public Relations Society of America chapter in my town to give a talk about podcasting of all things. And the reason why is because their membership had said they were very interested in learning more about podcasting and their clients, were starting to ask them quite a bit about podcasting, and they wanted to be better armed to discuss it. And so the other thing is that some of you folks out there, your next job may be, you know, same similar job, different company, and they’re gonna say, hey, go start a podcast, you need to know a little bit about it, or at least know where to go to get it. And, as I like to say, there’s this concept in management called management by in flight magazine. So the boss may come in next week, throw the in flight magazine down in the conference room table and say, I just read about podcasting. Go start a podcast. Now we’re gonna talk about whether it makes sense to do a podcast or not, but you know, I hope that folks will will stay with us here and but more, most importantly, Steve Sheinkopf, he is really going to miss out. In fact, if you’re a listener in the Boston area, and you’re shopping for appliances, or even if you’re not, I want you to stop by one of the conveniently located beautifully appointed yell, appliance, showrooms and tell Steve, that he really missed out on listening to this episode. Yeah, he’s gonna be good. Oh, yes, that’s right. That’s right. And because I’ve mentioned him on the show, people apparently are going into the showroom, and asking the salespeople for the marketing book, podcast discount, and now there is no marketing group podcast discount, but they’re, they’re asking you about it. But there should be Yeah, there should be and they’re going to Steve. And now finally, Steve said, What the hell are you doing? Stop saying that. Please go into the store and ask for it. Yeah, poor Steve. It’s not easy being Steve. So let’s get to the book I want to read from the introduction on page X X. For those listeners who use Roman numerals, podcasting is incredibly valuable, but can also be tricky to get started. There’s 100 different decisions to make some minor with minimal impact, and others major strategic decisions that can determine your success or failure. I’ve written this book to help you navigate those decisions and to help you avoid making the mistakes I’ve made myself and seen others make. So when I look up the word authority in the dictionary, there’s a picture of Alastair McDermott there. Now as someone who is older, but has the maturity of a 13 year old. Whenever I hear the word authority, I think of, well, it’s already been mentioned. So I want to go to the very end of the book and ask a couple questions you write on page 23. Having your own podcast solves multiple problems that experts encounter on the road to build authority. How so?
Alastair McDermott 13:27
Well, what we need to do is we need to create a body of work. So that’s that’s the way I think about it. As an expert, we need to demonstrate our knowledge in public. That’s how we become known, in the phrase, The Recognized Authority in their field. That’s the phrase that we’re kind of aiming for, there’s a couple of key pieces. And the recognized part is being known by people. And so in order to do that, we actually have to put ourselves out there, there’s another horrible phrase that people say, but they never really get specific about it. So the way I see it is we need to create high quality content that demonstrates our knowledge. And we do that on on a regular basis. And the medium of podcasting kind of forces that upon us because it forces us to be consistent in our content creation. And if you’re doing it hopefully the right way. It’s forcing you to do it in a way that’s creating value, demonstrating your expertise, and is also helping you develop. I mean, I know a hell of a lot more now, after 125 episodes and speaking to over 120 experts than I did when I recorded episode one. So you’re developing as well. So it kind of brings all of these different concepts together and ties them together and helps move us forward in building authority and becoming more of an expert.
Douglas Burdett 14:44
Also, at the end of the book you write I may be the unwitting owner of a Guinness world record for the longest time to start a podcast. Leah how so?
Alastair McDermott 14:55
So I was planning my podcast for quite a while. Several years Maybe over half a decade, maybe closer to a decade than half a decade.
Douglas Burdett 15:05
Well, you know, Alastair they say a measure twice, cut once. So
Alastair McDermott 15:09
yeah, so I started playing the podcast quite a long time ago, because I started listening to the first podcast that I listened to. Back in 2004 2005. That’s when I first started getting into podcasting. Back then we had to like there was no such thing as iPhones and apps and all that kind of stuff. You had to like wrangle the the mp3 file onto your little like, Zen player or whatever it was that you had. And it was just a lot of hustle. But I was really into podcasts. So I’ve always been a huge fan of the medium. And I knew that it was something I wanted to do myself. But when I started to try and plan and create my own podcast, what I found was that it actually uncovered some major kind of strategic problems with my own business. And I had to go and fix those first. So it actually kind of it was like it lifted up the rug, and showed me that there was a lot of things that I needed to do before it can actually do that step.
Douglas Burdett 16:03
But I would argue that was the right thing to do. In other words, it became a forcing function to get the business right, rather than rushing off, as we’ll talk about a few minutes with some of the some of the problems. So I think that’s more of an exception, that’s a good reason to hold off, because you wanted to get that other thing squared away first. But other than that, why do folks delay putting themselves out there? Well, I
Alastair McDermott 16:30
think that, in part, it’s, they’re not sure what to do. And hopefully, this will help. And there’s lots of other resources like this, but hopefully, this will just help to, you know, make it as an easy step by step process. And then the other thing I think, is fear, there’s, there’s a lot of fear around it. Particularly because it you know, it’s a bit different when it’s your voice than when you’re typing words on a keyboard, and it’s appearing electrons on a screen, you can kind of hide behind the keyboard a little bit when you’re writing blog posts and things. But when it’s your own personal voice that you’re putting out into the world or video two, I think that there’s a lot of fear and thoughts about that. There’s also some simple, I think that we like nobody likes the sound of their voice, particularly when they hear at first because we hear it through the bone conduction that’s in our school. So we hear our voice differently. And then we hear it on tape, and it’s totally different. And it’s like, oh my god, do I really sound like that. And, you know, there’s a lot of things like that to get passed to. So you know.
Douglas Burdett 17:25
And to the listeners, I just like to apologize for my voice. So I know for a fact that there are some listeners who are thinking about starting a podcast, they even posted on LinkedIn, I post a picture of your book this week, and a couple of them said, yeah, I gotta I gotta get going on that I’ve been holding off. So this is for you, folks. But let me ask the big question of all the 33 ways not to screw up a business podcast, Alastair McDermott, what is the number one
Alastair McDermott 17:53
mistake? Number one mistake is not to start, you absolutely have to start. Because if you don’t start, nothing else comes from it. The only way to totally screw up is by not starting at all.
Douglas Burdett 18:07
So well said the secret of getting ahead is getting started. And I’ve interviewed a couple of authors over the years, who both publish a blog post every day, and they’ve done it. Like one has about 9000 posts at this point. And the other is, well, one of them is Anthony Annarino, and the other one Seth Godin. And they publish a post every day. And they both said, on interviews I’ve done with them how they almost hope folks don’t read the first couple posts they did, because they certainly got better. And they also say, look, is tomorrow’s post going to be the best one ever? No. But I’m getting better at it. But I, I had a whole lot to learn. And I hope that I’m getting better. In fact, you talked about this in your book, there’s a sort of an About Us episode on every podcast, I call it episode 000. And it’s the like the trailer. And I update it every few years, which is of course your book has generated a massive to do list. I love it. I guess I thank you for that. But what I say in that I don’t. I just explained what the podcasts about trying to be as quick as I can. But one thing I do urge listeners to do is start from the newest episodes and work their way back. For two reasons. I hope I’ve gotten a little bit better than the very first episode. I don’t know the jury’s still out on that. But the other is that the topics covered or more relevant now than they were in 2015. Well, the first chapter is about having a clear business goal, which kind of takes us back to Alastair McDermott. I read the book, and I learned I learned something as I do in every book. But there were also a number of things in the book that I was aware of. But like with so many books that are on the show, I marvel at how the author explains it. And very often I’ll say I’m gonna explain it that way in the future. So thank you. Awesome, but I see there are certain chapters and I scratch my head saying really, really. So the first chapter is about having a clear Business School, would you say that more businesses don’t have a business goal for their podcast than do I think
Alastair McDermott 20:06
more that the the ones who are struggling to start are not clear about their goals. So if if they’ve gotten to the point where they’ve actually got the podcast, they probably crossed that bridge. But yeah, I do you find that there’s there’s that whole wishy washy, like I saw this when I when I worked in web design, you know, we need to have, we need to have a website, we need to have a podcast, there isn’t kind of a logical reason there. It’s just everybody else has one. So we need one, you know,
Douglas Burdett 20:33
it’s a scientific term called Check the box marketing.
Alastair McDermott 20:38
Yeah, I like your management by inflight magazine. That’s pretty much what we’re talking about here. Right.
Douglas Burdett 20:44
Well, anyway, that I just thought that was interesting. And I have to be, you know, again, I have to I really had to get in touch with my vulnerable side here. Because I did not start this podcast with a clear business school. I did it for very personal reasons. So please, don’t Nick me for that one. Now, the second chapter is about targeting a specific audience. Again, people don’t look to me, except as an example of how not to do it. I’ve seen a lot of podcasts not do that. And you know, I often hear that I think it was from Lipson the podcast service that most podcasts never get to episode eight. And I’m wondering if that there’s a variety of reasons for that. But is the issue of targeting a specific audience? Is that because niching down is so frightening? And I guess counterintuitive? Yeah, I
Alastair McDermott 21:33
think there’s a few things going on there. So first of all, just go back to the, to the example of your podcast, oh, no, you started a bit earlier than a lot of people. And people who start earlier can be more broad and more generic and have have a kind of a broader audience. People who are starting now, there’s a lot more to compete with. And that’s why it’s more important to have a niche or a niche, and specialize now and have a more clear target audience and topic, because you’re trying to cut through the noise of everybody out there. And that’s why the audience is so much more important for the listeners who are about to start a podcast than it was I think, for you.
Douglas Burdett 22:16
Okay, okay. Yeah. And the other thing to keep in mind is that you don’t need an enormous audience, you just need the right audience. So it seems like Podcasts can really do well as a real niche play. Like even if you’re in, there’s maybe only 100 companies you could sell to. It still could work quite well.
Alastair McDermott 22:37
Oh, yeah. And the other thing, I mean, it depends on it depends on your business and your business model, and you know, the size, your business and all of that, like for me, I’ve got one full time employee. And then I’ve got some subcontractors that work with me. And so in order to sustain a business that size, I only need about 10 or 12 clients a year. So the numbers that I need to sustain that type of business is going to be very different than an organization with 1000 employees or 10,000 employees. And so they’re going to have you know, it’s it, the new numbers can get very skewed and be very different. So I personally, I only need a small audience. Thankfully, it’s growing. And part of that, I think, is just longevity. But yeah, I do think it’s really important to plenty of start out to be quite specific. And it also depends on your profile. If you if you’ve got a pretty big profile, a big email list, you know, a big audience on social media, then maybe you can go a bit broader, you know, but if you’re starting out, then you need to have something laser focused to go through it.
Douglas Burdett 23:38
Yeah, you know, it brings to mind an author that was on the show. years ago, a guy named scouting or was a very popular sales podcast. And at the time, he wrote a book called Making rain with events. And he was working for a software company that provided event management for large conferences. Okay. So he started this podcast, and basically, he was interviewing people who were in that space, the large conference, you know, a lot of event planners and so forth. Now, let’s say maybe a third of them could have been potential customers, or they might have been customers for that company. But that wasn’t the main thing he was trying to do. He was trying to create great content for people that were like them. And then maybe another third could have been prospects. He just didn’t know. But he was networking with him, he would get to know them, he would interview them he wasn’t trying to sell on the podcast. And then the other third, were just people in the industry that wanted to know more about how to be successful and then it raised the profile for their business. So it was a very niche play and it worked very well for him. So I always mentioned that when I do presentations on podcasts and tell that tell that story of how it was enormously helpful for a sales guy. So the third chapter again, this one really surprised me honestly, I understand the first two and we’re not gonna go through every chapter here, folks, I if that’s what you’re thinking, is choose a Topic you love talking about? Is that really a problem? For some podcasters? I mean, are there podcasts where people hate the topic?
Alastair McDermott 25:09
Well, I don’t know. And maybe this comes back to how I wrote this book. So you mentioned earlier that you have an Jan’s Ron, and I don’t know for sure, but I may have heard her on your podcast. And that’s how I met her. And so I decided I wanted to interview her on my podcast. And so she introduced me to her publisher, Melissa Wilson, who I then interviewed. And at the end of that call, Melissa said to me, Hey, would you like to write a book for the 33 way series? And I said, Oh, I don’t know. What would I write about? And she said, Well, podcasting, obviously. And so that’s how I wrote this book. Now, I didn’t originally intend to write this as 33 ways, you know, not to screw up, I was just thinking about, I want to create some useful content to help my clients to start a podcast. So I was when I wrote this book, I kind of retrofitted the two concepts of here’s a step by step guide. And then here’s 33 mistakes. So I’ve actually the if you look at the structure of the book, it’s very much a step by step guide. And I figured that this was something that was actually quite important. And I think like, what I see when when I look at podcasts, that pod fade, that that dropped out,
Douglas Burdett 26:20
I’d never heard that term before. I’ll say what a pod fade is.
Alastair McDermott 26:23
Oh, yeah, so pod fading is when you start a podcast, and and you just fade away, you just can’t sustain it. And in order to sustain it, you have to have some level of passion about the topic, it’s just impossible. If you if you’re not truly, like, there’s a lot of there’s a lot of grind, there’s a lot of hard work, and you’ve got to do it for quite a while before you see, you know, in terms of revenue and monetary results, you know, you’ve got to do it for months, or possibly even years. And so in order to do that, you have to have some kind of passion for the topic. So that’s, that’s why I have that in there. And then also the kind of the idea of well, you know, when you’re planning the podcast, the topic is pretty important. So that’s, that’s why that’s in there as as a mistake.
Douglas Burdett 27:07
Hmm, interesting. I guess it might come up where an employee is told to go start a podcast. And they’re not particularly interested in it. But they’re, they’re told to go do it. I don’t know. It just, I found that interesting. But it’s so true. I know, the very first day, my podcast published January of 2015, I had two downloads. And you know how many I had the second day,
Alastair McDermott 27:28
the two downloads, 0/3 Day
Douglas Burdett 27:33
one downloads. So I was it was not looking good. But I wanted to do it, I have fun doing it. And that’s why I do it. So I think that’s interesting. And I actually know of an author, I interviewed, I liked the book, and I can say which one I liked to, but he did a podcast for a while. And he really, he didn’t enjoy it. It just wasn’t his thing. He wasn’t having fun. And you really do need to have fun. So let’s talk about another topic, which again, has implications for like doing blog posts, or, or any kind of regular content. And that has to do with the frequency of publishing interviews. And I’ve seen podcasters starting out who are a little overly ambitious in the beginning, and think that they can do a daily episode, or three episodes a week. What word of caution do you have for folks?
Alastair McDermott 28:26
Well, so I interviewed John Lee Dumas recently. Yes, he’s the poster child for daily podcast. Yes. And, you know, like, everybody told him daily was impossible. And he said, screw that I’m gonna do it. And he did. And like, he has a some crazy number. I don’t know, it’s like, 4000 podcast episodes now or something. But um, he is, you know, he is the kind of the, you know, he’s the go to guy in terms of podcasting everybody thinks of, but, so it’s worked out for him. But I think that not everybody is John Lee Dumas. And so that that is that is tough to implement. The other thing that there’s a kind of there’s an assumption in your question, which is that we’re going to do a interview podcast. And there are other formats. So just Oh, yeah, talk about that. Yeah. Because because, you know, there’s the solo episodes of the solo type, where you’re talking to the camera or talking to the microphone. And you know, you’re monologuing effectively, those ones are hard to do. You know, they’re hard to sustain people’s interests. But if you can do those, well, those can be incredibly effective for you in generating sales in lead generation, things like that. Those kinds of educational type podcasts,
Douglas Burdett 29:40
right. And I think that there are some people who may have come from a broadcast or radio background who just know how to do that, but I agree. They’re great to listen to, but they are very difficult for most people to do.
Alastair McDermott 29:53
Yeah. And then there’s a co host type podcast, which is like a buddy show. And so that’s where you’re talking with somebody usually that you Pretty well, like the really well known one in the in the kind of professional services marketing spaces David C. Baker. Oh yeah. Blair Enns, the two Bob’s, and that’s a fantastic show. And, in fact, all of my favorite podcasts have always been these bloody shows these co hosts podcasts, Jonathan Stark, Rochelle Moulton. And that’s there’s it’s called the business of authority. And let me see who else Liston Witheral. And Philip Morgan, who is a business coach that I’ve worked with. And Phillip is the OG specialization guy. And they had a one called offline. Now, unfortunately, offline is no offline. But that VAT is a brilliant, brilliant show to listen to. And when when you look at those shows, or listen to those shows, it’s about the relationship between the two hosts and how they know each other and those jokes. And you get to know those people. And it’s this parasocial relationship that is created. When you listen to people regularly, you kind of feel like you know them. I think that podcasting gives that more than other mediums. Even more so than video, like on YouTube, I don’t really understand the mechanics of how that works in people’s brains. But I kind of feel like podcasting, and we’re doing audio only here. But I kind of feel like the audio only element of it is almost more intimate than than with video.
Douglas Burdett 31:23
Yeah, we’ll talk about that in a minute. I just, I know that when somebody’s starting a podcast, that what they should keep in mind, if I could give some advice here is you can always add more later. But if you start out strong and then drop off, it may indicate that you’re not as committed to it. And it’s kind of like selling a product initially, very cheaply, and then suddenly getting much more expensive. It’s a similar, similar sort of confused dynamic that that people might have. One quick question about pot. Now this is this, this is just about podcasting. But I want to ask you about the cover artwork for a podcast, which is really important. Yeah. Just two questions. This is why should you not use a photo of the host unless they are a celebrity,
Alastair McDermott 32:12
because nobody is going to know who they are. So that real estate could be used for something that actually helps you to to stop the scroll in the podcast player. So can you put something else on there? Now? I mean, maybe if you’ve got a really interesting looking person, maybe an a fantastic photo, maybe maybe that will do it. But what like what you’re trying to do with it with the cover art because you’re trying to grab people’s attention and stop them scrolling past when they’re looking through their their podcast feeds or, you know, this this search. So that’s what you’re trying to do is you’re just trying to grab attention. And when you look at all of the other podcasts that are there any you can go into iTunes and pull up the, the list of all of the podcasts you see all those thumbnails. And you see how many people have faces that it’s just, you know, I don’t know this person. So why would that photo make me click on it? You know?
Douglas Burdett 33:04
Yes, absolutely. So that’s interesting. I, I went to high school with this Irish kid who later had a podcast and it made sense for him to have his picture on the podcast art. You know who it was Shaquille O’Neal? Both went to Cole High School in San Antonio. And I taught him everything he knows about basketball, but he will not admit it. So he knows he knows. So one other question, though, is why should they not have a podcast image like a microphone headphones is so far. I just thought that was funny. Is this for the same reason?
Alastair McDermott 33:40
No, is because
Douglas Burdett 33:44
they’re already in there already?
Alastair McDermott 33:47
You don’t you don’t need to tell us it’s a podcast. Yeah. So we don’t need to see a microphone or headphones. That is the most the most the most common? It’s yeah. I don’t even know how to how to explain because it’s just so obvious. But please don’t do that. Yeah, I
Douglas Burdett 34:04
think some people say oh, that’s what the graphic designer gave me or that’s what the art department gave me. So I guess I better go with that. Well, it is a podcast. Like it’s gonna be a billboard on the highway. So let’s talk about equipment. I’m twisting in the wind here. But I always urge folks to do all the work for a podcast before they buy the equipment. In other words, buy the equipment last and you know, work through some of these issues. Like we talked about, like your business goals and so forth. Your audience, things like that. Those are actually the harder parts. It’s easy to buy equipment. Unfortunately, a lot of people buy the equipment first and they never watch the podcasts are like going to the gym in January. You people know who you are. You join you get a membership and then you think it’s gonna get you in shape and then you never go back. But we need to talk about something that is near and dear to both our hearts. It really is. And when I say that, I mean it’s something that just drives me nuts. It’s one of The two things I don’t like about producing a podcast, and I’ll tell you what the first one is, one is having to say no to an author. The other one is arguing with maybe one out of 100 guests about what’s going to make them sound better for the listener. And let me I saw a t shirt recently that says on the front of it says anything but a Yeti. Meaning it’s like the explain why the Blue Yeti is very often the bane of podcasters existence.
Alastair McDermott 35:32
I just don’t understand the popularity of it. It’s It looks cool. And that’s amazing. I’ve heard people swear blind to me that this is, you know, the best microphone ever. But I just haven’t found that.
Douglas Burdett 35:46
Yeah, well explain the difference between a condenser and a dynamic mic, because I find myself having to do this all the time. And as you know, now, I actually send a video to the author’s explaining why their audio is so important. So condenser dynamic mic, can you explain that dynamic?
Alastair McDermott 36:06
See what I can but listen, let me just tell the listener, because they may not know this. But Douglas, you deliver a 10 minute lecture to everybody who sits down and thinks about coming on your podcast about the microphone and the quality and you really go to town on that. I really love that I watched I watched it again recently, because I was just just making sure I was prepped for this. And like, you really nail everything in that video. And like, I could just see how much this pains Yes.
Douglas Burdett 36:37
And here’s the reason not to drop a name, but Seth Godin, and I somehow gotten a conversation about this when I was interviewing him, because he really took the video seriously, he watched it a couple times. And I said, you know, occasionally these authors bicker with me about it. And he said, you’re a volunteer. You’re just trying to help them. And I am. And it’s almost like having my hand slapped. But I don’t think a lot of people know most of the author’s good. Wow, I didn’t know that about my audio sound. Well, but again, condenser dynamic. Well,
Alastair McDermott 37:07
I’ll try to answer the question this time, okay. So I don’t understand the technical differences. But the condenser mics are way more sensitive. And so they will pick up a PIN dropping or a dog barking three miles away. And they are absolutely brilliant for when you have a vocal artist working in this amazingly soundproof studio, where they’re recording, you know, high end vocals for you know, advertising or for music or anything like that. They are absolutely terrible. In a home office, where most of us are actually recording these or even in an office office. Because we don’t have it soundproofed and so what’s happening is it’s picking up all of the traffic driving by it’s picking up the dog barking three miles away, it’s picking up all of those things. And
Douglas Burdett 37:54
it’s picking up the echo in the room. Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Alastair McDermott 37:58
And like all of this stuff, it’s just coming on your audio and it’s, it’s just really bad. So the condenser mic is is for me is not suited to, to podcasting in an unsound truth on on treated environment, which is actually soundproofed the dynamic range microphone will pick up only what’s near it. And this is the amazing thing about them is is you move away from them, and it doesn’t pick up. And so the noise that’s happening outside unless it’s so for me, it’s trucks, motorbikes and airplanes, they’re the three things that managed to, to come on to the dynamic range microphone, but almost everything else won’t get picked up, like regular traffic, all of that kind of stuff. So the dynamic microphone is much more suitable, I think, for podcasting, in in any kind of on soundproofed environment. So that’s, that’s the way I think about it. So please, please don’t use a condenser mic.
Douglas Burdett 38:54
Ah, yes. And I feel like I feel like we were separated at birth here about this particular topic. And
Alastair McDermott 39:01
maybe, because I got a lot of this from you. And the reason why I know about some of this stuff was because I was checking out the marketing book podcast. And in fact, I messaged you back in sometime in 2020. And I said, Hey, Douglas, what does it take to to get onto the marketing book Podcast? I’m thinking about writing a book. And so Oh, wow, I forgot about that. Yeah. So I watched all your videos at that time. And and I noticed that you mentioned a study. So I went and looked up the professor, who was Professor Norbert Schwartz, and I interviewed him on my podcast about audio quality, because I was really interested in that. So yeah, that I felt really strongly about as well because I’ve been podcast listening for such a long time. That you know, I really appreciate when podcast hosts go and make the effort to have good quality audio, and then people like you who try to get the guests to be good as well. So yeah, that’s it’s that’s why you feel that way because I got a lot of that from you. So thank Keith,
Douglas Burdett 40:00
Oh, my pleasure. Wow. See, folks just reach out to me and I’ll try and I’ll try and help you. It hurts me. But also, when people hear this bad audio, they the the credibility of the guest plummets, and I’m gonna include a link to Professor Schwartz interview on your podcast, because I’m going to update that video. And ah, gosh, I don’t know. I’m just
Alastair McDermott 40:23
yeah, like, just just to re emphasize this. If your audio and video is good, you sound smarter, you sound more likeable, and it sounds like your work is more important. If your audio and video is bad. You don’t sound as smart. You don’t sound as likable. And that sounds like your work is less important. I mean, which of those two do you want?
Douglas Burdett 40:42
Yeah, yeah. And I need all the help I can get in terms of sounding smart. But if you are sound like you’re calling from a prison payphone, you’re not helping yourself. And if you’re gonna argue with me,
Alastair McDermott 40:54
I’m gonna move on to that stack of I think we better stop beating that drum. Yeah,
Douglas Burdett 40:57
sorry, sorry, this has turned into a kind of like a support group. Allison,
Alastair McDermott 41:02
so for the six listeners who are left,
Douglas Burdett 41:05
six, Oh, you’re too generous. So let’s talk about something that I don’t agree with in your book. But it doesn’t mean that I’m right. But it is time possibly for a fight. Why do you recommend recording video for an interview?
Alastair McDermott 41:21
Very simply because audio is almost impossible to repurpose in any useful way. And video is very easily repurposed in multiple ways. Now, when I say that in ways that are actually useful to our social media channels,
Douglas Burdett 41:37
you’re absolutely right. I mean, that’s true. I guess, the issue I have is I never watch a video interview. I always consume it while I’m doing something, I consume audio only, like when I’m working out or walking the dog or whatever. So I, I just I don’t really want to do that. But here’s another little reason I do it. And it was because of an affirmation I got from one guest, who was also a marketing guru podcast listener, Darrell Alfonso, author of the martec handbook. And he mentioned he liked being interviewed on my show and a few others where it’s audio only because he didn’t have to perform for the camera. He’s able to just sit there and not look at the camera and and just think about the answer. So I don’t know. I think what I am going to start doing though, is probably publishing my episodes on YouTube with just one piece of art. Because apparently, even in your book, you talk about how so many people listen to podcasts on YouTube. And there’s a listener in the UK, Daniel Carter, who told me Douglas, please just put your damn show on YouTube. Just do it.
Alastair McDermott 42:40
Yeah, one of my guests and then somebody I’ve known for quite a long time, Megan Dougherty. She, she has a podcast called accompany show. And she was telling me that you know that the numbers because because they do a report. Winstone creative is her business. And every year they do a podcasting report, and that the numbers of people who consume podcasts through YouTube was just astounding. And so I said, Okay, I’ve got to, I’ve got to start doing that. And, you know, I think so one of the things like what you mentioned earlier, it’s, it’s impossible for somebody on YouTube to consume your audio only podcast and like, assuming you don’t upload it as a video, but it is possible for somebody on YouTube to listen to your podcast while they’re driving, even on YouTube. Like they don’t have to watch the video of it. So YouTube is is it’s possible to watch video without without the video components. But it’s not possible to go the other way, if you know what I mean. And that’s why what I mean by repurposing you can you just get so much more out of it. Yeah, the other thing is the distribution effect of having those clips, because when you can create short clips out of your podcast, those are the things that will bring in new viewers to it. And that’s what video allows you to deal with later to clip out those 62nd vertical shorts that you see that TikTok on Instagram and YouTube shorts are all promoting.
Douglas Burdett 44:02
Yeah. Well, here’s here’s a podcasting question, though, for inside podcasting world, but I want to ask it because I was recently asked by a marketing person I know who’s been tasked with starting a podcast, maybe they have measured by in flight magazine. And she wanted to know if they should put wav files or mp3 files on their website. And the answer, in my opinion is neither explain what hosting is and why it really needs to be done for a podcast.
Alastair McDermott 44:29
Oh, yeah. So podcast hosting. So that’s where the actual audio files are held. That’s that’s where they live. And podcast hosting is is different from website hosting. So for example, you tend to build up a big archive of these files, and they’re not changed very often, but you need some big storage space to put them and it’s not really suitable for self hosting. That’s that’s not the way website hosting works. So you’re much better off using a dedicated pipe Cost hosting company for this. And so that’s not something that you want to change very often either. So it’s I think it’s much better to to go and just find a podcast hosting company to host your podcast, there are some free ones, although if you’re not paying, then you are the product. So personally, I like to pay for it. And don’t put more work on yourself just pay the 20 bucks a month or whatever it is,
Douglas Burdett 45:22
yes. And then they get it sent out to all the different places like Apple podcasts, Spotify, and so forth. And I think I pay 15 to $20 a month. So chapter 18 recommends including a call to action in every episode, do a lot of podcasts not include a call to action? Or do you find that they they don’t have good calls to action?
Alastair McDermott 45:40
Yeah, and I think it’s just, it’s, again, this is good practice. And what I think the actually the biggest mistake that I see with podcasts is they have too many calls to action. So you know, send me an email. And don’t forget to like, subscribe and rate the show and do this and do that and subscribe to our email list. And I don’t know what else I’m repeating myself at this point, go give
Douglas Burdett 46:01
Steve Sheinkopf a hard time.
Alastair McDermott 46:05
So we’ve we’ve got, we’ve got too much, and it’s kind of overload. So one clear, distinct call to action. And for me, I think it’s the email list and getting people onto your email list. But whatever it is, try and be be relatively consistent. It doesn’t have to be the same every episode. But I think that if you’re, you know, you’ve got one, like I’ve recorded several different and call to action, and I’ll just rotate them for my episodes. So I’ve got one, which is the write and review and one, which is to share it with somebody on one, which is to join my email list. And so it’s, you know, you can, you can take those and rotate them, you can record it live to tape, rather than having a pre recorded one that you add on the attack on the end. So it depends on how you record your show as well.
Douglas Burdett 46:49
Hey, just out of curiosity of those three, which one do you think gets the most traction?
Alastair McDermott 46:53
I think the one to check out my list because I know that my reviews are not great, like in terms of the reviews are all five star, but the number of reviews is not great. So I think I think there’s a lot of inertia to get people to leave a review. I think it’s tough. It’s difficult. And so if just to the listener, if you are a regular listener to a podcast, like the marketing book podcast, it would be really good if you went left a review, if you haven’t already, because it’s it’s bloody hard to get reviews.
Douglas Burdett 47:20
Thank you. And I’ll wire that money to you now. Yeah. And actually, just to add, if anyone does give a iTunes review to marketing book podcast, please let me know. And I’ll send you a small thank you in the mail anywhere in the world. So you write on page 143, asking a podcaster what their number one challenge is. And they’ll tell you that it’s growing the listenership? How do you do it?
Alastair McDermott 47:42
Yeah, it’s tough, it is tough. I think, again, one of those things is, first of all, to have a really specific topic on target audience. So you’re solving a real problem for somebody. And I think that’s really like a crucial thing. And that’s why it’s right at the start of the book. The other thing is to remind people to do it. And there’s where your call to action comes in. As you remind people to share it with their friends, if they find it useful, things like that. I think that this is where for me, the video clips come in. And so now putting up clips of the podcast on I put it up personally, I put it on TikTok, Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, I think that’s it, there might be another one. So but but having those vertical clips, it reaches a much broader audience. And those clips get shared because there are faces in those clips. And this is human nature, but but people don’t tend to be interested in videos that don’t have faces in them. So that’s why those those kind of audio wav. Oh, yeah, you
Douglas Burdett 48:47
talked about that the book? Yeah, yeah, they don’t
Alastair McDermott 48:49
tend to get as much distribution like, like, when I say not as much, I mean, like, they got about, you know, 5% of the distribution of, of actual video. So that’s, that’s why I think it’s so important is is to have that kind of that kind of content to promote the podcast. And it’s tough, you’ve got to, you’ve got to do a lot of things, right. And you’ve got to, for example, you’ve got to write good show notes, and good title. So the titles are quite get people to click on it when they’re doing searches, the episode titles, the show notes, again, they’re things that make people interested at the show notes actually are also come up in discoverability in terms of search, so somebody does a search and if you’ve got the show notes in there, and the keywords that they’ve searched for, that’s when you’re up episode will come up. So there’s a lot of little things that you’ve got to do. And, and that’s what I’m saying. There’s a lot of little details you got to get right. But that’s what will will bring in people but you’ve just got to the other thing is you’ve just got to do longevity. So yes, creating. So you’ve got to be providing value to people. You’ve got to get your audio and video quality, right. If you’re doing video, the audio quality we’ve done to that. You’ve got to be talking about something that you’re passionate About so that you can sustain it over the long term. And, and then you’ve got to have that call to action. And then you’ve got to create some sort of assets for social media to promote it to a wider audience, which is where the video clips from me come in.
Douglas Burdett 50:13
Yes, it really is a game of inches. You know, just growing it gradually getting folks to share it all that type of thing. And it’s kind of like marketing, where you probably hear this question all the time. But people will say, Oh, what’s just one thing I could do to market my business, and I’m like, oh, that’s that’s gonna be difficult.
Alastair McDermott 50:34
The other the other thing I didn’t even mentioned, there was the, the guests that you bring on. And so if you do have an interview podcast, and you bring guests on, you want to make it easy for them to share it. And so you want to give them some assets afterwards, like, at the very least, you want to give them a custom image that they can put it on their feed, maybe pre write a tweet or a Facebook post for them something to promote something that they can send their email list, you know, you want to get them to share that episode. Yes, it’s so true, shocking thing is that the higher profile guests, first of all, they when they come on, they may not promote your episode at all, because like, why would they what they don’t need to, they’re already promoting it just by appearing on your show. So I was kind of surprised. But it’s the smaller profile guests who actually like to promote your episode, I was talking to a former guest yesterday. And he told me that he now refers to the episode where I interviewed him on my podcast. And that’s his go to way of telling people about what he does. So that’s now a reference point in his kind of marketing. So you know, and you can tell your guests that this is something that, you know, this is like an asset for you. And that’s a way of getting them to promote it.
Douglas Burdett 51:48
So true. So true. I’ve had some authors who’ve asked me for the code, so they can embed the player on their website or something like that. But it’s true, the high profile people, I’ll email them and say, hey, it published today. I’ll never hear a response, completely ghosted. So it’s like, oh, well, it was a great interview. But there you have it. And I’m not sure why they hired a team of publicists to reach out to podcasters. But hey, enough of my suffering and belly aching. So last thing I want to ask you about is you have a chapter on promoting your podcast by being a guest on other podcasts. And I had to laugh. Oh, my goodness, let me bring, it’s on page 157. You right, when you launch your podcast, you’ll start to receive a lot of unsolicited emails suggesting guests for your show. These emails tend to be a fantastic guide in how you should not pitch yourself to others. I had to laugh because it was like, welcome to my world on a daily basis. Explain what’s going on there.
Alastair McDermott 52:46
So one of the things like when you publish your podcast, in the feed, there’s an email address. And anybody can can grab that email address by just looking at all the latest podcasts. So your podcast, your podcast, email is public. So don’t use your personal email in this first thing. Actually, I don’t think I mentioned that in the book. But that’s something I should do. But what happens is you get all these unsolicited messages. And they are terrible. Like they’re clearly from people who’ve never listened to your podcast, almost every one of them. Yeah. And so they send you this terrible, terrible pitch. Hey, great podcast. I really love that recent episode. Anyway, here’s my guests. Really?
Douglas Burdett 53:24
What’s the name of my podcast? Really? Yeah.
Alastair McDermott 53:29
At least at least go and try. And you know, auto insert the podcast name and the recent episode, you know, but like, it’s clearly automated, or somebody who you know, who doesn’t like their job. But it’s totally ineffective. And no, no real podcaster is going to take guests who they hear in that way, like, most podcasters, I think are going to, if you write a pitch, first of all, if it comes in on their podcast, email, they may not see it at all. Yep. And now if it does manage to get through that, that barrier, it’s got to actually mention their podcast and something that they’ve you know, and ideally, not their most recent episode, because that’s the low hanging fruit. You know, mentioned an episode that you enjoyed that wasn’t their most recent one. And, or maybe even more than one episode, like, you want to show me that you’ve actually listened to the podcast, you know what it’s about, you know, who I am, you know, the type of people who I have on, because people who’ve been podcasting and grow their podcasts, they care about their audience, like Douglas cares about his audience, cares about you listening, you know, he wants to serve you by having good audio and bringing good guests on and bringing good books on. So he’s going to be very choosy about the people he accepts on which is the way it should be. And yeah, he’s protecting your time and attention as a listener, and I would do the same for my my podcast listeners. This is also why I think that podcast listeners make for better podcasters but that’s a different topic.
Douglas Burdett 54:58
Well, it’s funny you say that I do to harken back Back to what you mentioned earlier, I think it was 2005. I started listening to podcasts. And I can remember plugging my iPod into, I guess it was an iPod into the cable on the computer and uploading the podcasts that I wanted. And I listened to a lot of podcasts. I do too. So, yeah, it’s interesting, and it’s sort of a cattle call. And I see that and on a bad day, sometimes I am tempted to get the email address of the author that is spamming me, or that has hired a company excuse me to spam like this and say, yeah, they are ruining your reputation. You’ve written a marketing book and look how you’re marketing your book. Oh, stop it. Stop the madness. Okay. Last thing I want to say, though, is there was on that same page you write, if you can show that you know what the podcast is about and what the listeners care about. You’re already ahead of 90% of guests pitches, if you can also reference an in joke, or something mentioned in a recent episode. So they know you’ve actually listened to an episode. You’re ahead of 99% of your competition.
Alastair McDermott 56:06
Can you dig it? Can you dig?
Douglas Burdett 56:16
Alastair McDermott, if readers took only one thing away from the book, what would you hope it would be?
Alastair McDermott 56:21
I hope that if you were in any way thinking about starting to do a podcast or any kind of content creation, that you realize that you don’t need to be ready, you need to just start. If you wait until you’re ready, you’ll never be ready. So just start and let the problems unfold in front of you and deal with them one by one, if you want to learn how to swim at some point you need to get in the water.
Douglas Burdett 56:43
Absolutely. Such great advice, but daggone it Alastair McDermott, that is the hardest thing to do. So let’s give the listener something to do. What is one thing a listener could do today to put in action, one of the ideas from your book, I tell you what mine was, I thought, you know, I’ll call it the marketing book podcast. And I thought, well, I don’t want to do it. I was like everyone else. I went on GoDaddy, I looked up if that URL was available, and it was and I thought, damn it. All right. Now, I’m not suggesting everyone do that. But what is one thing you could do today to put in action, one of the ideas from your book,
Alastair McDermott 57:18
start start to plan out a podcast. And I like I’ve got some resources that you can link in for free that people can download. And just just start to plan it out and think about if I was going to create a podcast, and who would that be for? And what’s the most value that I can help them with? What what problem? Can I solve for them with this podcast? And start start to think about that? And, you know, don’t worry about the detail too much. Just start a plan at the high level stuff.
Douglas Burdett 57:46
Yes, just the first few chapters here and don’t worry about the darn equipment. So Alistair, looking back, what books have most inspired your work and career
Alastair McDermott 57:55
is interesting. I asked on every podcast episode that I’ve ever had, I asked about books. And so for me, the most common answer is also the one that I would give people which is the E Myth. And I think that that is the probably the most crucial, the E Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber. And that that’s just been crucial for me, and Michael Port, Book Yourself Solid. There’s a few other books like that, that have been really useful for me. And, yeah, I read a lot of business books, and I buy a lot of business books and read a little bit of them, just the bit that I need. And then I don’t read the rest of them. So I’ve also got a lot that I can go through as well. But I think that you know, if it was just one book, it would have to be Gerber.
Douglas Burdett 58:40
So at marketing book podcast.com We’re gonna include links to everything linkable, including all the books that have been mentioned the episodes that I’ve mentioned, your website, your LinkedIn profile, your Twitter account, I’m also gonna include a link to a place on your website on how to sound and look good on Zoom and podcast tips and audio video recommendations for consultants and experts and there’s which you can download I believe from you or you go I think you have to go to Amazon but then it’s free. It’s free people come on, and there’s also a resource page for people who bought this particular book. So include links to all that and now word to you, dear listener, big favor, please reach out in some way to Aleister congratulate him on the book. Thank him for being a guest on the 450th episode of the marketing book podcast. guests on the show told me that they really enjoy hearing from marketing book podcast listeners, and not just because they’re ridiculously good looking like Alistair’s. Also, if you’re listening on your smartphone, and you subscribe to the marketing group podcast on your favorite podcast app like Apple podcasts, all these things can be found by going to this episode right now, unless you’re driving and clicking on this episode’s website link. The book is 33 ways not to screw up your business podcast a comprehensive guide to planning recording and launching your business podcast the author is Alastair McDermott. Aleister, thank you very much for joining us on the marketing A podcast.
Alastair McDermott 1:00:00
It’s been a pleasure and honor. Thank you.
Douglas Burdett 1:00:04
And that closes the book on another episode of the marketing book podcast. I hope you’ve enjoyed it and found it helpful. If you are one of the hundreds of listeners who have left an iTunes review, please let me return your kind favor by mailing us some marketing book podcast, bookmarks and laptop stickers. Just send me your mailing address anywhere in the world. And I’ll drop it in the mail. And remember the words of the entrepreneur, author and motivational speaker Jim Rohn, who said, formal education will make you a living self education will make you a fortune.
Alastair McDermott 1:01:08
Thanks for listening, I know that you’ve got a choice of podcasts and shows that you can listen to so I really do appreciate your time and your attention. If you did find this episode. Interesting. I would truly appreciate if you could take 30 seconds to rate the show in your podcast player or even leave a text review. It won’t take you long but it has a huge impact on the growth of the show. And it also helps to motivate me and continuing to do it. So it’s right where you’re listening to the show. You can also find a link in the show notes which will take you to rate and review. Thank you again. See you in the next one.
